Primary sense

--- In jcs-online@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Tintner" wrote:
>
> Ralph: One of the gifts of shifting to just 7-10 degrees of central vision in one eye is the validation that tactile sense is primary, even though the power and speed of our vision sense normally blinds us to this reality.
>
> I wonder whether you or anyone else would like to expand on this? It’s probably not the tactile sense, but the spatial sense that is primary – our sense of our body in a surrounding space, which is both proprioceptive and exteroceptive.   Vision certainly was a relatively belated sense in evolutionary terms. Worms apparently are blind.
>
> I’m trying to think about the relationship between our spatial sense and our visual sense – but coming up with very little.
>

Mike,

First off, I should clarify that it is my feeling and strong trial theory that tactile sense is primary for all of us -- that that's the way, along with all of reality also  being nested structured~duality, that I am ~seeing reality.

Second,  my shift in vision, to me, was more like a confirmation or reminder that the tactile sense is primary.  The initial insight or impression developed decades ago when I developed and played around with (experienced) hand-held magnetic tetrahedra. --Structured one-half spins of attraction and repulsion via the analog math, all the way in through the direct entrance into our deep physical intuition.  

Losing most but not all of my sight in December of 2008 and since then relying

Kneading nested structured~duality: Entropy (ordering) reconsidered

(jcs-online - Tue Oct 16, 2012 11:59 pm (PDT Revised.) Redefining reality as nested structured~duality may seem strange to most people at first, particularly to those who are staunch advocates of the western scientific paradigm, or to advocates of spiritual-emotionalism, ineffability and/or qualia-(mis)-founded perspectives. The strangeness arises, mainly, because we are generally not very happy when we get down to really considering our core assumptions or tenets. And we become even more anxious when our subconscious signals emanating from our paradigm shield walls continue to register impressions, or ~proof after ~proof after ~proof, that all our treasured mass-energetic-informational tenets actually do knead down to, and are enfolding within the emerging, more unified tenet of nested structured~duality. The impending paradigmatic change initially feels catastrophically unsettling. In this week's impression, the reader is asked to reconsider "entropy" or "ordering". Again, basically, this term or attribute is all relating to structure. That statement alone, may crystallize the lesson for some long-time readers. We normally prioritize 'entropy' as something like a second-level tenet, secondary to the allegedly primary mass-energy equilibria. However, if one kneads the entire lump of tenets and attributes and concepts and also our budding impressions of consciousness or even consciousness-ing... it's not long before one can notice that there is this other way of seeing where structure, or more accurately, structured~duality emerges as the root tenet. 'No, no, noooo', the western scientific trained rational personality screams, as the obviously valid 'what-if' alternative rolls lumbering into view again. The signals add up, this new ball rolls easier, almost of its own accord. First of all, things have structure. Structured~duality is primary. Shifting one's root paradigmatic tenet, however, initially feels simply catastrophically unsettling. And yet, relativity and variable mass-densistiy obviously knead down into nested structured~duality. Quantum mechanics, too. And now, entropy. By reducing to and adopting the proper inner and enfolding tenet, now the stuff in the physical realm as well as everything in the mental realm rest upon the same one common tenet. Moreover, the simple things, like abstract math's previous "uncanny ability" to map and model many physical features and relationships, or how it is that observation is an influential feature at all, unravel easily. And, yes, there still is an unfolding structure and ordering... Think about it. Entropy/energy-matter: yet another instance of nested structured~duality. Enjoy. Best regards, Ralph Frost With joy you will draw water from the wells of salvation. Isaiah 12:3

~Evolution (jcs-online post 10/9/2012)

Thanks Serge, Nicely worded: "To urge the belief system disappear is unnatural. What can be urged is just to replace one belief system by the other. So, the Third Way approach is suggested to replace both Evolutionism and Creationism." I generally agree, that below the Fourth Nested Way given our present limited understandings, we DO face this basic journey of moving from one trial theory to another, to another. This seems to me to be clearly apparent in the dreadfully accurate storyline that I advocate where reality turns out to be nested structured~duality and/or where portions of our internal representations of our surroundings, surprisingly enough, ARE fashioned in stacks and sequences of quite transient, vaporous collections of hydrogen bonded water molecules, forged together in respiration in concert with experience. The reductionist within us finds merely stacked and structured pluses and minuses, albeit predominantly in tetrahedral-like shapes -- at least within our our local neck of the woods. And so as it is that we have the responsibility to believe something then it behooves us, actually, to have belief and faith in the existence and occurrence of quite incredible and miraculous things which, in fact, do match up with large fractions of our quite incredible experiences in life. As well, it behooves us also to think upon that which is good and pure, and life-giving, and joyful, and liberating... The slant I put on this magnificent adventure is the one where the "paradigmatic flaw", so to speak, is a quite simple one, lodged in the root, or the constipated bowels of the presently dominant western scientific paradigm. ~Descartes trial theory -- the cube/subject-object instance -- is a wonderful and wildly useful initial approximation, but, as we see on this end of the era, it and its epi-cycles simply do not match up with our actual surroundings and our reality. And, as most of us periodically encounter, the accumulated consequences of our social and technological systems built upon such slightly inaccurate beliefs is started to complicate, rather than enhance smooth operations, signalling the time to make another change. Okay, perhaps my specific proposed tetrahedron/north-south instance of nested structured~duality is not a guaranteed complete slam-dunk enabling expansion (evolution) throughout the galaxy, but, again, as you say, Serge, what we face here is migrating from one belief system to another (to another)... The most difficult part of most journeys is usually taking the first awkward step. I often wonder, if not ~this shift in the scientific paradigm, then which one? And, if not today, then when? There is a rule, or suggestion, somewhere in paradigm mechanics lore, that one should make the paradigm adjustment in the region or level of organization nearest to origin of the troublesome flaw. I often get the impression that some people deem the paradigmatic flaw to not be in or related to our physical model or approximation. Might we discuss those types of beliefs here? Best regards, Ralph Frost With joy you will draw water from the wells of salvation. Isaiah 12:3

Time as an innate scientific dimension? Really??

Okay, so earlier today, while replying to a jcs-online post by the always kindly Serge Patlavskiy, and while considering the belief/tenet that "time is an innate dimension", I stumbled onto  an odd set of facts that turn out to innovatively disrupt the theory of relativity and our waning dominant scientific paradigm.   Since that incident, to me, has a dream-like feel, even now, I am making this effort to scribble out and perhaps solidify, expand on or clarify  the basic notion.

----


Time as an innate scientific dimension?  Really??
Applied structured~duality: de-bunking space-time

Ralph Frost
July 12, 2012

The belief  or tenet that time is an innate dimension of physical reality  is part of the presently dominant  spatial-temporal scientific paradigm.

The corrective analysis is done within the alternative trial theory of an enfolding structural-energetic paradigm wherein reality is nested resonant structured~duality.

When we say things change as a function of time, we misunderstand. We actually are meaning changes occur as some function of the influences of the vibrations of everything else.

We acquire a belief in temporal causality through repeated use of this  misunderstanding either in the effort to operate on a simplification  or  as a implicit conceptual/linguistic error.

The error is hidden in that we can  and do isolate  many vibratory or oscillating systems and define and use them as a "clock" to measure "time".

The apparent truth of  the empirically validated temporal causality is facilitated due to the fact that "the influences of the vibrations of everything else" are universally present, in parallel to the oscillation of our favored "clock system". 

This conceptual and/or paradigmatic flaw is empirically validated  even up into many of the initial validations of general relativity.   

The scientific fact is that things vibrate and oscillate due to "the influences of the vibrations of everything else". Thus, other than as a conceptual and misleading artifact or simplification, there was and is not absolute time, and therefore also was and is not any remedial curved space-time.   Time is  a mental function and is NOT present within the ~physical system.  What is present are  "the influences of the vibrations of everything else".
Considering, say, curved space-time, though, and some of its empirical validations,  if we look carefully,  we observe that there are variations in the densities of "the influences of the vibrations of everything else" along various paths.   These nested variations in the "influences of the vibration of everything else" account for  apparent and measured  curvatures as well as variations in various expansions and contractions.  

There is an intuitive symmetry between the patterns and insights summarized here and  "the influences of the vibrations of everything else" locally selecting  patterns of 6^n structural coded  water molecules within respiration sites, in our process of constantly building an internal hydrogen-bonded representation  of our local surroundings.  [These connections or precursors were developed previously and are presented in earlier articles.] 

The conceptual temporal flaw revealed here and elsewhere by other researchers [Barbour] disrupts relativity and reveals that theory to be some type of simplification or approximation of a nested multiple-state approach to summing up the influences of vibrations of everything else.   The conceptual error does the theory in.

The so-called "unification" occurs  within the emerging, more robust nested structural-energetic scientific paradigms.


Further outside reading:
http://discovermagazine.com/2012/mar/09-is-einsteins-greatest-work-wrong-didnt-go-far/article_view?b_start:int=0&-C=

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julian_Barbour  particularly Timeless physics

De-bunking time and space-time

[In jcs-online  as "Time as a memory function: debunking space-time Re: Consciousness and the doubl"]


--- In jcs-online@yahoogroups.com, Serge Patlavskiy wrote:
>
>
> Ralph Frost on July 6, 2010 wrote:
> >I suggest your notion of time as a derivative of information
> > doesn't go far enough. Your i = st, to me is more like an
> >on-ramp to, or perhaps a small vehicle traveling on the six
> >lane, double level bridge between the spatial-temporal, and
> > the enfolding structural-energetic paradigms.
> >
> >Our flawed and convoluted notions of time "as a dimension"
> > miss all references to time as being memory functions.
> >Your i = st connection with "information" may be more like
> >a second or third derivative.
> .
> [S.P.] Suppose, there is a child, its father, and an uncle who lives in a different country. When the uncle comes to see his nephew once a five years, he cries: "Wow, how tall you are now (comparing with your height five years ago)!".

Image Processing (jcs-online)

Dear Mike Tinter,

Sort of like "the theater of the mind" being a popular resting place for many?

The thing with "explaining consciousness as the movie theater of consciousness as a 3-d movie theater which the self responds to with all its senses..." is  "the self" is already like yet another n-d feelie theater within the idealized 3-d movie theater,  held within a delicately balanced protein-folded and also hydrogen-bonded tension within the enfolding variable mass-density environment, etc., etc.

And, like "mind", I consider our term: "self" as a wildly ambiguous term.

The approach that I think is best, of course, is the trail I have experienced and followed. Roughly, the one I'm on starts our in an chaotic cauldron, and then passes  through "fields of study" of surveying and mapping, civil and structural engineering, chemical and biochemical properties, transactions, unit operations and systems, seasoned with a smattering of Buckminster Fuller's synergetics, and then punctuating that with some variety of religious experience wherein I get the impression I'm asked if I'd like to present a scientific discovery.

From there, basically, the discovery/creation of magnetic tetrahedra (http://magtet.com) syncs with

Create surface; apply labels. Spawn labels; generate surfaces.

Whether the precise term is "image" or something else, I suggest we do have nearly universal agreement that we're all running a system that generally, automatically forms an impressionistic surface or image and then adds (re-called, re-extracted) sets of associations and labels to the impressionistic surface.  That is, this process occurs during sensing or experiencing things within the surroundings.  And, once this process is acknowledged, then it is also clear that "imagination"  seems to sometimes be this process run in reverse where collections of labels or experiences spawn active internal imagery or surfaces.

In the nested resonant structural coding trial theory of consciousness I am advocating,  the "automatic"  structural coding process occurs within the formation of stacks and sheets of ordered water forged in respiration reaction sites -- within neurons -- in the process of harvesting electrons that will later resonate within synaptic processes.

Adding, or should I say, discovering the "automatic" image or surface formation  layer  within the synaptic/neural networking layer has advantages. The primary process generates "an image". The secondary process echoes or replies with worded, memorable associations giving the experience of either re-cognition, or else discovery of additional connections. Having a related, but two-process system accentuates the existence of resonant communication over period of experience.  Again,  the "temporal appearance", of course, is highly illusory and related to other of our sustained enzymatically catalyzed biochemical resonances.

Discovering the primary "image" formation process in respiration facilitates seeing the neural networking as a simple, secondary development.

For those who may be interested in developing physical intuition along and within  the loose tenets of this trial theory a global science education tool is available at http://magtet.com

Best regards,
Ralph Frost

With joy you will draw water
from the wells of salvation.  Isaiah 12:3